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New XBLA MP maps

 
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Dark Reyn
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 PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:40 am    Post subject: New XBLA MP maps Reply with quote Back to top

In hindsight I realise that I should have given the “XBLA mods” thread a more specific title but too late now.

Looking at the new maps that Wreck has put together at http://n64vault.com/wiki:ge:xbla-multi-mods and the poll at https://www.twitter.com/GoldeneyeMods/status/1376413012580577288 I thought I would start some discussion here (nothing to do with the fact I don’t have a Twitter account and am not sufficiently keen to make one...)

My thoughts regarding the established MP maps:
Temple - not my favourite but certainly a classic and good with certain weapons
Complex - good map (although I confess I prefer the PD tweaked version)
Caves - terrible
Library - too big, maybe it would work for GEX where you have sims but I think it fails to function for GE
Basement - reasonable, good with certain modes
Stack - my personal favourite
Dam - I think the default BZ is better as non linear
Facility - I think FZ is better as the BZ is largely linear
Bunker 2 - good generally
Frigate I think could do with a tweak - set the balcony ones not to spawn and the other “99” doors unlock, remove the crates, move weapons F0 and F5 to the lower decks and maybe add the helicopter as an explodable object.
Archives - FZ is a good map and BZ can also be pretty fun. No idea if you can have both but I’d be tempted if I could
Depot - I didn’t really take to this and it’s pretty dark
Caverns - I dislike, both FZ and BZ seem weak to me with their various corridor platforms
Egyptian - huge and not that interesting

1P maps:
Runway might work if you filled it with crates and oil drums and stuff which it seems to partly be although a little unfinished
Surface might work for a sniper level but would be terrible for most other weapons
Bunker 1 is like a less interesting version of Bunker 2
Silo too linear
Surface 2 (see surface 1)
Statue too dark and worse with the new graphics
Streets too open although you could do the first section with obstacles maybe
Train linear but... maybe?
Jungle - best bit already included (and it’s terrible)
Control seems like it has potential to be good
Cradle - by rights this ought to be terrible but I found weirdly enjoyable
Aztec - Could work well I think. I would probably do from pit round to exhaust bay (open air with blast doors closed) so as to remove the linear first bit

So my optimal list would be:
Temple
Complex
Basement
Stack
Dam (BZ)
Facility (FZ)
Bunker 2
Frigate (full as described above)
Archives FZ
Archives BZ
Train
Control
Cradle
Aztec (lower zone+BZ...?)

If I can get my head round the presets etc this is what I will try to build.
I’m sure people will disagree with me!


Last edited by Dark Reyn on Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
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Wreck
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 PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2021 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Haha, I just find it amusing how you've listed certain maps as too linear, and yet Train - which is totally linear - is in your final fourteen. Razz

I do have a version of Frigate ready to go. It may feel a little big for only two players, but Turbo cheat can help with large levels. I also recently figured how to remove the hits from the bridge windows, so you can fire through them at other players.

Control MP is also in the works. It's not the full map, as I felt that might be big. I just need to finalize placements and weapon ordering, then get Control using an MP setup. A task I have been relying on others to perform.

Everyone dumps on Caves. It's good fun with grenade launchers. Gives really great opportunities for skillful bank shots.
 
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Dark Reyn
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 PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wreck wrote:
Haha, I just find it amusing how you've listed certain maps as too linear, and yet Train - which is totally linear - is in your final fourteen. Razz

Heh. Total hypocrisy, it’s true. If I’m honest it’s probably bottom of the list but I’m not sure I like any of the other options much more. And part of me wonders if that particular map may work although cannot rationally justify. I would still keep Facility and that is fairly linear (I always wondered why PD didn’t connect the vent to the top of the bottle room with the high platform you can climb).

Wreck wrote:
I do have a version of Frigate ready to go. It may feel a little big for only two players, but Turbo cheat can help with large levels. I also recently figured how to remove the hits from the bridge windows, so you can fire through them at other players.

Nice one. Re the bridge windows, I saw that on the update, really nice touch, I’d assumed it wouldn’t be possible. I can foresee much craziness with grenade launchers and the like.

Wreck wrote:
Control MP is also in the works. It's not the full map, as I felt that might be big. I just need to finalize placements and weapon ordering, then get Control using an MP setup. A task I have been relying on others to perform.

I look forward to it and seeing which bits you decided to include.

Wreck wrote:
Everyone dumps on Caves. It's good fun with grenade launchers. Gives really great opportunities for skillful bank shots.

Heh. It never really did it for me. What you describe is what I quite enjoy on Basement.
 
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Kerr Avon
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 PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Why isn't Statue available in Goldeneye X as a multiplayer level, when (according to http://n64vault.com/ge-xbla-multi:statue-cradle-mp ) it "had fully functional multiplayer setup files leftover in ROM"?

It would surely be great in Goldeneye X.
 
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Wreck
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 PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

For the same reason why it wasn't used in original GE; frame rate and memory. While PD does use Expansion Pak, so that would help for rendering rooms, all those polygons on-screen would hinder performance. PD really isn't much different than GE, after all. I'm not sure if optimizing the BG would help, because of the complexity of that map. I did cut back on Cradle's BG for GE-X, which helped dramatically. But that level was much easier to optimize for multiplayer.

I was surprised by my Twitter poll just how well Train did. Unfortunately, it uses far more doors than any current MP setup. That means no multiplayer setup can be repurposed for it at this time. If it is just for a single level patch, I could probably use the Train mission setup for it. Nobody plays the campaign with the MP mods, anyway. I still pay great care not to alter any pads used in the mission (unless is only an AI Path Network one, where I can shift or rotate), since they are shared with multi. So if one day we can extend things, and allow more levels in multi, my setups should be completely safe to utilize.
 
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Dark Reyn
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 PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Can the map just be done without most doors? Although tbf I would still prefer Control by far. And would sooner have Aztec than Train too.

Last edited by Dark Reyn on Tue Apr 06, 2021 10:56 am; edited 1 time in total
 
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Kerr Avon
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wreck wrote:
For the same reason why it wasn't used in original GE; frame rate and memory. While PD does use Expansion Pak, so that would help for rendering rooms, all those polygons on-screen would hinder performance. PD really isn't much different than GE, after all. I'm not sure if optimizing the BG would help, because of the complexity of that map. I did cut back on Cradle's BG for GE-X, which helped dramatically. But that level was much easier to optimize for multiplayer.


Oh, I see. It's a pity, but if the Statue level couldn't be made to work well in Goldeneye X then fair enough. Hardware limits are a pretty big brick wall, of course. Would it have been unplayable with just one human and eight sims, since that means only graphically rendering each screen frame once, no split screen?
 
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