ShootersForever.com Forum Index

GoldenEye 007 Nintendo 64 Community, GoldenEye X, Nintendo 64 Games Discussion
GoldenEye Cheats, GoldenEye X Codes, Tips, Help, Nintendo 64 Gaming Community


Texture guidelines
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ShootersForever.com Forum Index -> Goldfinger 64
View previous topic :: View next topic  
radorn
007
007


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1424

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

May I suggest a little organization guideline for the submitted textures?

Each person that submits a texture to the repository would append a given handle he choses at the start of the filename, his/her nick for example.
Each user should take care of not making duplicate names within his/her "namespace".

Like this:
monkeyface_bricks1.bmp
monkeyface_grass4.bmp
radorn_jailbars.bmp
radorn_whatever.bmp

These names should not be changed when used in your maps.
When converting levels to GE format it can be done like this.
Someone is tasked with adding the needed textures into the ROM, and anotates the preset numbers.
When importing a given level, the submitted textures.txt files should all contain the correct names so it would only be a matter of adding the correct preset numbers to the file and import.

Of course, when a texture is submitted to the repository, it would be more or less set on stone, and some coordination would be needed to decide whether to delete it or not. This would consist in confirming it's not being used by anybody, and in the case it is, trying to see if that texture can or can't be replaced by another one.

What do you think?
 
View user's profile Send private message
monkeyface
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 275

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yes, okay, I could see that working. It's important that we have a single texture.txt to work with. If I understand this correctly, would this texture.txt include hundreds of texture names, and you'd have to use it everytime, even for the slightest of changes in your map?
 
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
SubDrag
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Posts: 6118

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yes, we must mantain single textures.txt! That way everyone's level works, and everyone can reuse any texture and the texture #s are consistent (don't need to keep redoing bg files). Also, you must NOT delete any, and only add to end.
 
View user's profile Send private message
monkeyface
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 275

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Say hello to the almighty textures.txt.

http://goldfinger64.googlecode.com/svn/TEXTURES/textures.txt

Edit: he's already showing ill will towards me. Behold the one that eventually will take five minutes to load when you're importing textures.


Last edited by monkeyface on Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Dragonsbrethren
Hacker
Hacker


Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3058

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

You need to fix your url tag, you've got a space in there, that's why your post isn't showing up.
 
View user's profile Send private message
radorn
007
007


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1424

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

No, that's not exactly what I was saying, but it wouldn't hurt either, I guess.
You could do it like that, but it would be hard to have to maintain an updated textures.txt file because at anytime a new texture could be added.
Also, it wouldn't make much sense until all is said and done since not all textures would be in place, and it would force the maintainance of an updated ROM with these textures.

What I was saying is to first keep the filenames under control, and if you download one from the repository, you should keep the name.
Preset numbers are not important now.
Each person can have their own texturename-to-preset correlation table to work on their own, but if filenames are kept identical across all modders, you can submit OBJ+MTL files that will work for everyone else.
If you download an OBJ format level you just need to add the preset numbers to roms that match what you have in your rom.

This is most useful for when everything is set and monkeyface or whoever will take care of adding the final set of textures to a ROM and import the maps into the game.
 
View user's profile Send private message
SubDrag
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Posts: 6118

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

All right, I suppose we can recompile all stages later. I guess it's still too early, but at some point we will need to do that. For now I guess just share texture as much as possible.
 
View user's profile Send private message
radorn
007
007


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1424

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

SubDrag wrote:
All right, I suppose we can recompile all stages later. I guess it's still too early, but at some point we will need to do that. For now I guess just share texture as much as possible.


Yeah, my suggestion was to make something now that will help compilation in the end.
If you work now with the texture filenames already set, correlating them to presets in the final compilation stage will be much easier and straightforward, less error prone, and will also make easier to perform a reduction of the number of textures or their size if needed.

Forcing a ROM with textures and an accompaining textures.txt now into users would not only be a pain to maintain but will also hinder the independent work of modders.


Last edited by radorn on Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
View user's profile Send private message
Dragonsbrethren
Hacker
Hacker


Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3058

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

The SVN should make keeping an up-to-date universal textures.txt file manageable. We simply add our presets to it as our maps are finalized (as in, don't bother adding to it for test imports, wait until your map is 100% complete) and we don't need to worry about manually editing the preset numbers in a GE-format map.
 
View user's profile Send private message
radorn
007
007


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1424

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Dragonsbrethren wrote:
The SVN should make keeping an up-to-date universal textures.txt file manageable. We simply add our presets to it as our maps are finalized (as in, don't bother adding to it for test imports, wait until your map is 100% complete) and we don't need to worry about manually editing the preset numbers in a GE-format map.


But that would more or less defeat the purpose of sharing textures...
Also, what if you are using one of the original textures and then you suddenly find out that it's been replaced by something else in the last update of the ROM and textures.txt file of the repository?
 
View user's profile Send private message
Dragonsbrethren
Hacker
Hacker


Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3058

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wait, who said anything about editing or replacing the original GE textures? Textures can still be easily shared between maps. If the texture you want to use is already in the universal textures.txt, just edit yours to use that preset. It's certainly better than waiting around with a finished map that needs secondary indices, shadowing, clipping, a path network, a setup, etc. just so that everything can be imported at once. I think you're overlooking how much work goes into these maps after they're imported and converted to GE format.
 
View user's profile Send private message
radorn
007
007


Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 1424

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Dragonsbrethren wrote:
Wait, who said anything about editing or replacing the original GE textures? Textures can still be easily shared between maps. If the texture you want to use is already in the universal textures.txt, just edit yours to use that preset. It's certainly better than waiting around with a finished map that needs secondary indices, shadowing, clipping, a path network, a setup, etc. just so that everything can be imported at once. I think you're overlooking how much work goes into these maps after they're imported and converted to GE format.


I thought secondaries could be imported from OBJ, or at least that's what Subdrag told me once http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?p=24894#24894
You can also import clipping, I think

I may be wrong, but I think this situation would be possible:
You build a map, independently of any universal texture set, unless for the explained texture naming scheme.
You import into GE and start working in your presets, paths and all the stuff as always.
Now fastforward to the project's end. Everything is going to be compiled into a single ROM and new texture presets have to be assigned.
You export your geometry back to OBJ from the editor, make a new textures.txt file by adding the published correlation of textures to preset numbers or, even better, use the universal one you talked about, which would be provided by the "compilation master" (xD) and use it to reimport your full geometry back into the level without touching your existing clipping, presets, portals, paths or anything else.

Wouldn't that work?

Note that the universal textures.txt file I'm talking about here would only exist at the end, and not during development.
For the normal work, modders would just add the textures freely to their test ROMs, but keeping a consistent naming scheme would ease things up. It could even help the sharing of levels among hackers for joint test purposes (like, if, for some reason, you want to try to test putting your level and that of some other hacker in a test ROM).
You would provide both the GE format files and the OBJ.
The other user would have to import the GE format level in his ROM. At this point texture presets would be wrong. You then use the provided OBJ format level, modify the textures.txt file to match the correct texture presets in your test ROM and import geometry back. Now textures are right.

Again, I may be wrong, but from what I gather of the workings of the editor this should likely work.


Last edited by radorn on Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:45 pm; edited 2 times in total
 
View user's profile Send private message
monkeyface
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 275

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Compilation master is the greatest title I've ever heard.

That's what I thought of, let's hope it'll work. That'd be the best solution.
 
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Dragonsbrethren
Hacker
Hacker


Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 3058

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

radorn wrote:
I thought secondaries could be imported from OBJ, or at least that's what Subdrag told me once http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?p=24894#24894
You can also import clipping, I think

They can be imported, yes, but they still require work to be done manually at the moment.

radorn wrote:
I may be wrong, but I think this situation would be possible:
You build a map, independently of any universal texture set, unless for the explained texture naming scheme.
You import into GE and start working in your presets, paths and all the stuff as always.
Now fastforward to the project's end. Everything is going to be compiled into a single ROM and new texture presets have to be assigned.
You export your geometry back to OBJ from the editor, make a new textures.txt file by adding the published correlation of textures to preset numbers or, even better, use the universal one you talked about, which would be provided by the "compilation master" (xD) and use it to reimport your full geometry back into the level without touching your existing clipping, presets, portals, paths or anything else.

Wouldn't that work?

I've never tried it; I suppose it would, but I fail to see how that's any different from the method I proposed. It simply adds two extra steps, and I don't see the point. We don't need to wait until the very last minute to do this stuff, if our maps are finished they're finished, we can mark down our texture presets and be done with it, never even needing to look at the .obj file again. The whole point of the SVN is to make stuff like this easy, you just checkout the latest textures.txt, mark down your presets and texture names, and commit that change.

Edit: This won't work, the same properties of the secondary indices I mentioned above aren't retained in the exported .obj. All of that work would need to be done again, something I'm personally not willing to do. If we do go with this method, I'll be doing a find and replace for the preset numbers with a hex editor.
 
View user's profile Send private message
SubDrag
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Posts: 6118

 PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I wouldn't go back and forth between obj and regular, though it may in theory be possible, but you lose any special commands you put such as transparency. It's easiest to mantain textures file as you go, then once you're in GE, keep it there, is why I was hoping to get one textures file. The one drawback is it's still so early so textures can change.

What do we think? This is worth coming to a consensus so it's not painful later.

If our textures.txt is too big and we have a lot of obsoleted textures from not being allowed to delete it I can always write a tool to strip them out and offset the others. But I hope we can do better


Last edited by SubDrag on Sat Jul 18, 2009 4:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ShootersForever.com Forum Index -> Goldfinger 64 All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Cobalt 2.0 BB theme/template by Jakob Persson.
Copyright © 2002-2004 Jakob Persson


Powered by BB © 01, 02 BB Group

 


Please Visit My Other Sites: GoldenEyeForever.com | GrandTheftAutoForever.com

Got kids? Check out my Dora The Explorer site with games and coloring pages!

Our forums feature Nintendo 64 games, GoldenEye 007 N64 New Maps and Missions, GoldenEye Cheats, N64 Emulator, Gameshark, GoldenEye Multiplayer and more!

[ Privacy Policy ]