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SubDrag
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I could see a sweet mid-level cut-scene.
 
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monkeyface
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Never thought of that. Hmm. Are there any maps that have mid-level cut scenes? From the original game or otherwise, never seen it in action before, I think. But it would work, and it wouldn't pose a problem? In any case, we got a storyboard. I believe radorn can cite Michael Bay as a huge creative inspiration.
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

mmm, I have never seen a mid-level cutscene either, I think. I just heard the talk about them before and thought it could be a good idea. I would like to see one (in video format, if possible)
How hard are they to make, anyway?

Anyway, isn't that laser a bit too high-poly, monkeyface?
Also, could you provide the cannon and base as separate elements (could use the same textures and even the same mtl-file). I ask about this because that way it would be easy to make versions pointed at different degrees of inclination.
In my idea for the fort-knox door blowing up, the laser car would be farther away and point a little lower, towards the center of the door, than where it points at now.
If you have it in another format which supports components (groups with their own coordinate system) you can send that too instead of OBJs.
 
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SubDrag
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

It's been used infrequently in our levels, not in Rares - the main issue is that you lose all keys, etc, once a scene happens so it doesn't a lot of times fit into a level.
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I'm not really into intermission cutscenes; I think they pull you away from the game too much. As SubDrag mentioned they also reset your inventory to whatever is set in the intro block (but not until after you fire a shot, so that can't even be worked in for story purposes), which is never a good thing. There are workarounds for it, but like I said, I'm just not into them and would rather not see them in the project.
 
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monkeyface
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Oh god, I worked under the impression that the tank vehicle was 600 tris. It's only 339. And the laser is 549. Damn. Have to do some work, then.
Yes, sure, what other format than .obj supports components or clusters or whatever you could use. Deled type?
I kind of agree with dragonsbretheren on that one. That's one of the things Goldeneye did well, even if it was kind of primitive, it went through the motions and never took away your control.
 
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SubDrag
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

You know what - you're right. GE was great because there was no interruption in the action. The focus was fun gameplay, not fancy cut-scenes. It will be a great prop though, when that rooms modelled.
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah, there are a lot of cool things that GE did without ever pulling you out of the action. If you wanted to hide behind a gas tank in Facility and blast those soldiers as they came through that door you were free to do so. Nowadays I think the vast majority of games would use a cutscene for those sort of things.

(I'm kinda screwing up the props thread again, heh.)
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

hmm i havnt seen the move in a while. forgive the incorrectness. But i think the lazer sceen could be done well with the use of a cut scene. The mission starts i guess and your snooping around the building with the lazer. When you get caught or whatever happens you could go to the cutsceen. You could put the cut scene camera on the table and make a bond model without a head. You could doo the whole onversation that happens while the lazer is triggerd. when its done and however you break free, your weapons wouldve been confiscated so you have to get a new one. i think it could work nicely
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I like how GoldenEye didn't interrupt the action. Maybe we can get the scene to happen much like how facility did the ending (ie trapped in a room with laser), without a cutscene but showing off the prop.
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
I like how GoldenEye didn't interrupt the action.


thats debatible. Facility waiting speech stuff, controll natalia speech ect..

but i see what your saying. its like the whole halflife gordon freeman situation. Everything threw your eyes and your control(mostly).

whos mapping this level out?? when the levels structures are finalized i think they should be made public. Everyone could have a go and test things out, try different objectives and whatnot. Since many people using the editor im guessing just modify the setup, it would give them the chance to contribute. Then put to a vote i guess the best setup file would be used. or bits and peice taken from one to another to make a solid complete one. just a suggestion...

reading the making of goldeneye kind of suprised me. nothing was set in stone. Well main objectives yes, but there was a lot of freedom with how the missions would play out[/quote]
 
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

If this were a PD mod, intermission cutscenes would be perfectly acceptable (not to mention proper working). But as a GoldenEye mod, I'd also suggest keeping them out. They not only strip all of the keys you've collected up until that point from your inventory, they also take away your control. In GE, you're always in control. Even if you're speaking with another character, you have the option of leaving or shooting them dead. A cutscene will remove the players ability to choose for themselves. That's one thing that made Rare's FPS titles unique.

(Yes, I know this isn't GoldenEye 007, it's Goldfinger 64. However, GE is such a classic because of how it was designed. Deviating from that too much will change the feeling of the game, making it seem more and more like something else. Perhaps that's a good thing, or perhaps not.)

Also, I'm not totally sure, but I think the beginning of a mission has to go directly from a single static camera position and into your "swirl" (first-person transition) camera. It might be possible to set up a scene beforehand, though. Usually they save that kind of thing for the ending. Take Surface ii and Cradle, for example.

The laser looks wonderful, by the way! Smile
Hope it doesn't change too much as you optimize it.
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Dragonsbrethren
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wreck wrote:
Also, I'm not totally sure, but I think the beginning of a mission has to go directly from a single static camera position and into your "swirl" (first-person transition) camera. It might be possible to set up a scene beforehand, though. Usually they save that kind of thing for the ending. Take Surface ii and Cradle, for example.

If you timed it well, you could do a cutscene in the intro camera. Take Dam for example, that one scene where the guard closes the security gate, that could be considered a cutscene. The problem is you have very little time, and if the scene was important you'd need to limit the mission to one camera (Intro cameras and the swirling camera are another one of those unique GE things I'd hate to see go).

Personally, I think in-mission scenes are the way to go. Check if Bond is near a pad/in a room where he can see it, then have the "cutscene" play. If the player wants to run over and screw everything up they're free to do so. If they really screw things up you penalize them with a failed objective. Just don't take away their control.
 
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

One mission that is full of "scenes" would be Statue. Each one features a different penalty for not seeing them through to the end.

a) Valentin. Attempting to leave the freight container before he's finished speaking will result in a failure. Since you obviously aren't taking him seriously, why should he waste his time telling you anything?

b) Janus. There are multiple ways to cut this scene short. By failing to holster your weapon during your conversation, Janus will signal his men to open fire. Coming within too close of a distance will threaten him into exiting. Once you've figured out who Janus really is, you're free to do as you may.

c) Natalya. Not an overly complex sequence, but effective. With time ticking down, you must reach her before the chopper explodes. Once you step into the set range, a proximity trigger will go off. It resets the clock and forces you to move quickly. Hell, you can always just watch her get blown up as she sleeps.

d) Mishkin. All you need to do is go peacefully through the park gates. Any act of violence toward the Defense Minister or his men will cause Natalya's demise. Perhaps that's not actually a bad thing.

Four different "scenes" during the mission. All of them giving you total control of the outcome. That's something you just don't get these days. Smile
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 PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

radorn wrote:
mmm, I have never seen a mid-level cutscene either, I think. I just heard the talk about them before and thought it could be a good idea. I would like to see one (in video format, if possible)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKs8g-pLX0

That was our original attempt at a cut-scene. As others have pointed out, what was quickly learned was that all inventory COLLECTED up to that point would be lost. The only way you can sneak a cutscene into a level is to do it early before the player collects anything.
 
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