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007 - The World Is Not Enough
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zoinkity
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1666

 PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Sorry, I meant quarter size. Aegh...
We're talking 64x64, 32x128, 16x256 color images getting diminished down two shifts to 16x16, 8x32, 4x64, etc. Each mipmap level is effectively 1/2 the previous image size, and this drops two. This works because only part of each image is loaded into the RSP at a time, otherwise they'd have to ditch or precalc mipmapping / overload to fit the entire tile into dmem at a time.

That's a heck of a drop, compounded with dropping antialiasing for some arcane reason.

There's some inherant design problems with making too-pretty models.
For instance, there isn't much call for the flashbang to use two textures, a blue 64x64 one and another 32x32 grey one for the rest of it. The blue texture is, at best, a glorified gradient and could have been simulated with raw, untextured vertex color.
Also, they were too worried about making things too round. In actual fact, unless you see a polygon on-end you can't tell exactly how many sides it has if you've mapped it with a 'round' texture. I remember a topic in the Dawn of War community talking about keeping rounds down to maybe the hex - octagon range unless it's really large or noticable to merit more--and it isn't like PCs could handle more.

Part of this has to do with large company game development. Dedicated 3D artists generate the models and textures for multiple games at a time based on designs and/or summaries written up by the design+art team. So, these guys have no clue that their model is overkill and the texture depth way overboard, and nobody from the programming department is going to spend time to outline why none of this is even noticable on final product.

To be fair, Eurocom usually just handles ports of other people's code. My qualm with their work on this title is that it didn't fit very well into their engine and the engine wasn't modified to improve the quality. UA/MGM did want a Bond game that came out before thier next movie, after all, but I can't help feeling that it could have been a lot more.
It has nothing to do with comparison to GE, PD, or anything else. It was just a lousy way to program the game and it suffered for it.

To give credit where credit is due, the final Turok engine was stunning. Not sure if that was running quagmire or not, but it was really amazing and even kept a near solid 60hz. If anything, PD could be improved by porting into it.
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MAURO
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Joined: 19 Jan 2012
Posts: 92
Location: Brazil

 PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Aside from the guards face, I don't think they are too crappy at all. You won't get close to their face as much as you do in GE.

And about faces, Goldeneye has some REALLY UGLY guys.
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Bond: Your last chance! Give me the name!!

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MRKane
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Joined: 11 Dec 2008
Posts: 956

 PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Looking at TWINE from the angle of a developer, it misses the crucial blend of elements (however crappy or good they might be) which results in heaps of fun. There's no real recipe for exactly what results in "fun" there's a few good things to consider (immersion, involvement, entertainment and emotion) but at the end of the day, some things (ie. minecraft) seemingly disobey the rules and succeed while more accomplished productions don't.

I think TWINE just didn't have the balance quite right in my opinion, and that's why people are quick to talk it down.
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AverageGamerStoner1
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Joined: 21 Apr 2012
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 PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Been having audio problems when I try to play this game on emulator. With Mupen64, whenever I load this game it has no sound at all.

Does anybody know what causes this and how to fix it?
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MAURO
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Joined: 19 Jan 2012
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 PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

AverageGamerStoner1 wrote:
Been having audio problems when I try to play this game on emulator. With Mupen64, whenever I load this game it has no sound at all.

Does anybody know what causes this and how to fix it?


This game has issues in many aspects when emulated. You could try the game with project 64, but go to options and disable the voices, because the emulator will just make some weird noise.

Aside from voices, the game will run with a perfect sound.
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zoinkity
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1666

 PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Eurocom used a peculiar audio library when they created the game. The RCP handles not only video but audio, and the way high-level emulation works they interpret the code instead of running it the way console does.

Basically, the audio support is buggered since nobody reverse-engineered the audio. That's also why Sub's tool can't make heads or tails of it.

If you can't live without it, use a low-level emulator like MESS. These emulate all of the N64 hardware to ensure perfect accuracy, at the cost of eating your computer's CPU and RAM alive to do it.
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Maxout
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Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 656
Location: Washington State

 PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Opinions aren't facts. I can see many reasons why we prefer things over others. But isn't that an opinion?

TWINE wasn't too bad. IMO too much like a regular game instead of GE. Normal atmosphere and quicker scene to scene.

From what I can tell. I don't even know what commenting about it gets me/us?
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Dragonsbrethren
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Joined: 23 Mar 2007
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Figured I'd post this here since it's the active TWINE thread, rather than bumping one from 6 and a half years(!) ago. Zoinkity, you mentioned a code to disable the loading screens in this post:

zoinkity wrote:
MP blew monkey-butt and seriously, what was that nonsense about Good guys and Bad?

Why they didn't alias the screen like most other N64 games I'll never know, but the one thing I really, really didn't like was the total BS load screens. The interesting thing is that the load screens weren't even necessary. There's even a code that utterly abolishes them.

Okay, the 5-10 minute long stage where you swim was just idiotic. Jumping is pretty much uncalled for in any non-platform based game. There was virtually no distinguishable difference between explosives and pop-cans. The MP stage design was utterly attrocious with 1, maybe 2 exceptions.

The biggest issue was scale. The stages themselves were linear but not necessarily bad. Unfortuantely most were long. As in physically long. It took for freaking ever to move anywhere in that bloody game.

Typical crappy EA 1st-person shooter. They should just stick to Madden.


Do you happen to have this? (Also why did I remember this little detail from so long ago?)
 
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Kerr Avon
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007


Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 785

 PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

zoinkity wrote:

Sadly, the textures are much, much larger than GEs. Virtually every one of them is a 64x64 indexed, and despite them being, on their own, pretty good (which they should be, since most came from the standard library), they were applied to surfaces at too low a proportion, so you never see anything but the second mipmap of each (half size)--even with your nose pressed against it. So in other words they might as well have used 16x16s, since those are the only images used during rendering. As an interesting fluke, that means that some emulators will actually make the game look better than console since they don't support mipmapping in the first place o.0


Now that backup cartridges are so numerous and affordable that we can play modified roms files on our N64s, could someone (subtly looking at Zoinkity) perhaps fix the graphical problems with TWINE (including the anti-aliasing), please? I can't do it, I couldn't even spell 'subtly' - I had to look the spelling up (and even now I'm not convinced it's right...)
 
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Maxout
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007


Joined: 04 Apr 2006
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Location: Washington State

 PostPosted: Sun Dec 22, 2013 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yikes. I can see some vindictiveness in myself.

TWINE felt too rock 'em, sock 'em in a sense. Slight pacing issue too. I'm also too use to GE to fully get into TWINE.
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dlevere
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Joined: 09 Jan 2012
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 PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:10 am    Post subject: Gabor Not In Level GameShark Code (Twine) (N64) Reply with quote Back to top

Goldenboy and Czar Dragon are two people who taught me how to hack GameShark codes. I was playing T.W.I.N.E. the other day, and came across these gems that helped me beat the Night Watch level:

Hacked by Goldenboy

Moon Jump (press C-Up)
D10E0778 0008
813A6484 3FF0

Gabor Not In Level
80399949 0000
8039994E 0000

Here is a complete archive of Goldenboy's codes.
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Trevor
007
007


Joined: 15 Jan 2010
Posts: 885
Location: UK, Friockheim OS:Win10-Skip PerfectGold:v4.1

 PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wow, I was just goijng to ask about the rom locations today, looks like Ive been beaten hahaha.

Zoink, can you supply the ROM location for the VI Register data (osViSetMode) to enable AA.

The other game Id love to enable is SW Ep 1 Racer, it badly needs AA

Trev
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Sogun
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Joined: 15 Dec 2010
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 PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Is it possible to patch TWINE and SW Ep 1 Racer so they have antialising on console?
TWINE sure needs it, although SW Ep 1 Racer with the hi-res mode looks pretty good. Wouldn't the adition of AA hurt the framerate too badly?

I already used Zoinkity's patch for Rush 2049 to enable 4 player races and default cheat menu. It works as a charm with the ED64 and you can see why they restricted races to 2 players, hehe. But is good to have the chance to race with more people even if you need to add 100% fog so it's barely playable.

What other games could be patched to include missing features and/or add graphic filters?
It would be nice to have a mario Kart 64 with no bombs in VS mode and superfast courses (adding sound would be out of the question). Or Wave Race 64 with 4 players VS. Surprised

What are the chances? hehe

Oh, and I think the Never Say Never Again hack doesn't work on console. I'd have to check that... is it fixable?
 
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Kerr Avon
007
007


Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 785

 PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Dlevere, thanks for the link to the TWINE codes. I'd seen the 4 AI Bots splitscreen code before (I think), and Acceptable67 and Subdrag converted it from a Gameshark code to a patch for the rom file!

The patch can be downloaded from;

http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?t=6441


Sogun wrote:
Is it possible to patch TWINE and SW Ep 1 Racer so they have antialising on console?


I'd like to see TWINE with AA, and also using the full 64x64 tiles, or whatever it is. Not something we need, as (I think) TWINE looks OK now, and if we cared about looks much then we wouldn't be playing games on a nearly two decades old console, but it would be interesting to see TWINE the way it was presumably intended to look.[/quote]

Quote:

Oh, and I think the Never Say Never Again hack doesn't work on console. I'd have to check that... is it fixable?


What is the Never Say Never Again hack, please?
 
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Sogun
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Joined: 15 Dec 2010
Posts: 625
Location: Valencia, Spain

 PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Kerr Avon wrote:
What is the Never Say Never Again hack, please?

http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?t=4257&highlight=nsna

It works with ED64. The only problem is that all the stuff is yet to be unlocked by default. I can probably use Goldeneye save files to unlock them, I'm sure all was available when I tried for the first time on PC.

I think I was confused with Wii64, it doesn't work there.
 
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