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How to alter the weapon spawn point combinations
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Kerr Avon
007
007


Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 913

 PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:54 am    Post subject: How to alter the weapon spawn point combinations Reply with quote Back to top

I'm posting this in response to the thread "Weapon slot locations":

http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?t=7051

as I didn't one to post it in that thread as it's so large and would make the thread too long.

I'm not sure who wrote the following document,
as I copied and pasted it as a .txt files from an
internet forum. It details the use of the "Disabled"
setting in the Weapons allocation menu of the Combat
Simulator (multiplayer mode) of the N64 game Perfect
Dark. This is a very comprehensive and detailed
document, and is well laid out, though at the moment
I don't know how well it applies to the XBLA XBox
360 version of Perfect Dark.

This document is copyright whoever wrote it (I don't
know who, and I can't find the text on google.com
or bing.com), and all credit for the work and
studying goes to them.


------------------------------------------------





Maybe this is old news, but it's news to me.

I've stumbled upon new weapon slot spawn point
combinations. I always thought "disabled" meant that
slot would be filled randomly with one of the other
weapons you did choose each time you play. But actually,
it's a bit different. Putting disabled in the set
divides the spawn points up differently from 1 to 6.
Disabled means something is removed which causes a shift
in the remaining slots. They are combined. Putting a
disabled anywhere in the 6 positions gives new
combinations. The actual weapons appearing where they do
is still based on which number position they're in, but
the number of disabled's you have determines which
spawn points are joined. Likewise, setting a slot to
nothing will make nothing appear in the new joined
locations. For example, in Felicity, the
bathroom and the pillar by the window are number 3
right? Well, with 1 slot disabled, those 2 locations now
have 2 different things in them. It's like disabled


means that slot is gone from existence and now the
spawn points it represented are divided up among the
remaining slots.

Below are the locations that are joined by the same
weapon based on how many disabled's you chose to
include. You'll have to experiment with where to put
weapons and where to put disabled's on the setup screen
to get the mixture you want, but these are the new
joined spawn points. Some of these location descriptions
are confusing, you'll want to check each level to see
where the original points are in relation to what I've
named them. I've checked all of these but there could
be a mistake here or there. Sorry if there is. But yes,
the spawn points that are joined are determined by how
many disabled's you have set; 0, 1, 2, 3 or 4.
This is confusing!

________________________________________________________

Note: There are dashes next to each new slot and it's
locations. Also the original slot locations with no
disabled's are included for reference.
________________________________________________________

FELICITY

*no disabled*
1. pillar in main hall/balcony
2. room next to main stairs/tank room without stairs
3. bathroom/pillar by window
4. tank room with stairs/dead end room
5. bottom of main stairs
6. back hall

*1 slot disabled*
--pillar in main hall/back hall
--room next to main stairs/pillar by window
--balcony/tank room without stairs
--bathroom/tank room with stairs
--dead end room/bottom of main stairs

*2 slots disabled*
--pillar in main hall/bottom of main stairs/bathroom
--balcony/pillar by window
--dead end room/tank room without stairs/back hall
--tank room with stairs/room next to main stairs

*3 slots disabled*
--pillar in main hall/balcony/dead end room/tank room
with stairs
--tank room without stairs/room next to main stairs/
bottom of main stairs
--bathroom/back hall/pillar by window

*4 slots disabled*
--tank room without stairs/dead end room/back hall/tank
room with stairs/room next to main stairs
--bathroom/balcony/bottom of main stairs/pillar in main
hall/pillar by window

________________________________________________________

VILLA

*no disabled*
1. outside cave in grass/ground by broken railing
2. between broken rail and catwalk/indoor spiral ramp
3. wooden walkover bridge/cave
4. catwalk/column below catwalk
5. room with divider
6. dead end balcony

*1 slot disabled*
--ground by broken railing/dead end balcony
--outside cave in grass/between broken rail and catwalk
--indoor spiral ramp/cave
--wooden walkover bridge/column under catwalk
--catwalk/room with divider

*2 slots disabled*
--outside cave in grass/cave
--wooden walkover bridge/ground by broken railing/room
with divider
--dead end balcony/between broken rail and catwalk/
catwalk
--column below catwalk/indoor spiral ramp

*3 slots disabled*
--cave/dead end balcony/wooden walkover bridge
--column under catwalk/ground by broken rail/catwalk/
outside cave in grass
--room with divider/indoor spiral ramp/between broken
rail and catwalk

*4 slots disabled*
--between broken rail and catwalk/indoor spiral ramp/
catwalk/column below catwalk/dead end balcony
--wooden walkover bridge/outside cave in grass/cave/
ground by broken railing/room with divider

________________________________________________________

FORTRESS

*no disabled*
1. elevator bottom rooms near center
2. behind bottom doors
3. elevator top rooms/center of catwalks
4. elevator bottom rooms near elevator
5. balconies
6. back hallways

*1 slot disabled*
--elevator top rooms/center of catwalks
--behind bottom doors
--elevator bottom rooms near center/back hallways
--elevator bottom rooms near elevator
--balconies

*2 slots disabled*
--behind bottom doors/back hallways
--elevator top rooms/center of catwalks
--elevator bottom rooms near center/balconies
--elevator bottom rooms near elevator

*3 slots disabled*
--back hallways/center of catwalks/elevator top rooms
--balconies/behind bottom doors
--elevator bottom rooms near center/elevator bottom
rooms near elevator

*4 slots disabled*
--back hallways/elevator bottom rooms near elevator/
behind bottom doors
--elevator bottom rooms near center/center of catwalks/
elevator top rooms/balconies

________________________________________________________

WAREHOUSE

*no disabled*
1. loading dock under roof/room with hovercrate
2. catwalk
3. tunnel leading to dock/top of boxes in catwalk room
4. under boxes in catwalk room/climbable boxes room
5. vent/under vent hole
6. non-existent

*1 slot disabled*
Same as no disabled

*2 slots disabled*
--room with hovercrate/loading dock under roof/vent/
under vent hole
--catwalk
--tunnel leading to dock/top of boxes in catwalk room
--climbable boxes room/under boxes in catwalk room

*3 slots disabled*
--room with hovercrate/climbable boxes room/loading
dock under roof/under boxes in catwalk room
--tunnel leading to dock/top of boxes in catwalk room
--catwalk/vent/under vent hole

*4 slots disabled*
--loading dock under roof/tunnel leading to dock/top of
boxes in catwalk room/vent/under vent hole/room with
hovercrate
--climbable boxes room/under boxes in catwalk room/
catwalk

________________________________________________________

AREA 52

*no disabled*
1. outside by straight crawlspace/hall near closed room
with glass windows
2. closed room with metal windows/stairs room
3. small 4 doors room/closed room with glass windows
4. above the trench/bent crawlspace
5. in the trench
6. inside by straight crawlspace

*1 slot disabled*
--outside by straight crawlspace/inside by straight
crawlspace
--stairs room/hall near closed room with glass windows
--closed room with metal windows/closed room with glass
windows
--above the trench/small 4 doors room
--bent crawlspace/in the trench

*2 slots disabled*
--closed room with metal windows/above the trench
--in the trench/outside by straight crawlspace/small 4
doors room
--closed room with glass windows/hall near closed room
with glass windows
--bent crawlspace/stairs room/inside by straight
crawlspace

*3 slots disabled*
--closed room with glass windows/small 4 doors room/
inside by straight crawlspace
--outside by straight crawlspace/bent crawlspace/hall
near closed room with glass windows/above the trench
--in the trench/stairs room/closed room with metal
windows

*4 slots disabled*
--outside by straight crawlspace/closed room with glass
windows/hall near closed room with glass windows/in the
trench/small 4 doors room
--bent crawlspace/closed room with metal windows/
above the trench/stairs room/inside by straight
crawlspace

________________________________________________________

COMPLEX

*no disabled*
1. walkway below roof/upper walkway of room with 7 exits
2. sniping point across bridge/balcony above basement
3. snipers nest/floor of room with 7 exits
4. floor between 2 ramps/basement
5. roof
6. columns room

*1 slot disabled*
--columns room/upper walkway of room with 7 exits
--walkway below roof/sniping point across bridge
--floor of room with 7 exits/balcony above basement
--basement/snipers nest
--floor between 2 ramps/roof

*2 slots disabled*
--floor between 2 ramps/sniping point across bridge/
columns room
--balcony above basement/basement
--snipers nest/upper walkway of room with 7 exits/roof
--walkway below roof/floor of room with 7 exits

*3 slots disabled*
--sniping point across bridge/balcony above basement/
roof
--walkway below roof/upper walkway in room with 7 exits/
basement/floor between 2 ramps
--columns room/snipers nest/floor of room with 7 exits

*4 slots disabled*
--basement/balcony above basement/floor between 2 ramps/
sniping point across bridge/columns room
--roof/walkway below roof/upper walkway of room with 7
exits/floor of room with 7 exits/snipers nest

________________________________________________________

SEWERS

*no disabled*
1. blue bottom hallway corner/next to manhole
2. floor above the water/bottom of ramp up to chute
3. yellow bottom hallway corner/hall between manhole and
elevator
4. in the water/next to chute
5. on the pipe
6. brick hallway

*1 slot disabled*
--blue bottom hallway corner/brick hallway
--next to manhole/floor above water
--bottom of ramp up to chute/yellow bottom hallway
corner
--in the water/hall between manhole and elevator
--next to chute/on the pipe

*2 slots disabled*
--next to manhole/yellow bottom hallway corner
--next to chute/brick hallway/floor above water
--bottom of ramp up to chute/in the water
--hall between manhole and elevator/on the pipe/blue
bottom hallway corner

*3 slots disabled*
--in the water/blue bottom hallway corner/next to
manhole/next to chute
--hall between manhole and elevator/brick hallway/
yellow bottom hallway corner
--bottom of ramp up to chute/floor above water/on the
pipe

*4 slots disabled*
--yellow bottom hallway corner/on the pipe/blue bottom
hallway corner/next to manhole/hall between manhole and
elevator
--brick hallway/next to chute/floor above water/bottom
of ramp up to chute/in the water

________________________________________________________

TEMPLE

*no disabled*
1. small room with 2 doorways/bottom sand room
2. room with 3 ddorways and 1 door/under the hole
3. room up from 4 corners path/dead end
4. the top room near hole/"T"path up from under hole
5. room next to 4 corners path
6. the top room far from hole

*1 slot disabled*
--small room with 2 doorways/top room far from hole
--bottom sand room/room with 3 doorways and 1 door
--under the hole/room up from 4 corners path
--dead end/top room near hole
--"T"path up from under hole/room next to 4 corners path

*2 slots disabled*
--bottom sand room/room up from 4 corners path
--room next to 4 corners path/dead end/small room with
2 doorways
--under the hole/top room next to hole
--room with 3 doorways and 1 door/top room far from
hole/"T"path up from under hole

*3 slots disabled*
--room with 3 doorways and 1 door/under the hole/room
next to 4 corners path
--dead end/room up from 4 corners path/top room far from
hole
--small room with 2 doorways/top room next to hole/"T"
path up from under hole/bottom sand room

*4 slots disabled*
--top room next to hole/top room far from hole/room with
3 doorways and 1 door/"T"path up from under hole/under
the hole
--small room with 2 doorways/room up from 4 corners
path/room next to 4 corners path/dead end/bottom sand
room

________________________________________________________


GRID

*no disabled*
1. under long ramp/right from bottom of elevator
2. top of long ramp/left from bottom of elevator
3. floor under #5/cubicle
4. floor under #6/red hallway
5. balcony by glass floor
6. balcony outside cubicle room

*1 slot disabled*
--right from bottom of elevator/balcony outside cubicle
room
--left from bottom of elevator/under long ramp
--top of long ramp/floor under #5
--floor under #6/cubicle
--red hallway/balcony by glass floor

*2 slots disabled*
--cubicle/balcony by glass floor/right from bottom of
elevator
--red hallway/left from bottom of elevator/balcony
outside cubicle room
--floor under #5/under long ramp
--top of long ramp/floor under #6

*3 slots disabled*
--cubicle/balcony outside cubicle room/floor under #5
--balcony by glass floor/top of long ramp/left from
bottom of elevator
--floor under #6/under long ramp/red hallway/right from
bottom of elevator

*4 slots disabled*
--balcony by glass floor/under long ramp/floor under
#5/cubicle/right from bottom of elevator
--balcony outside cubicle room/red hallway/left from
bottom of elevator/floor under #6/top of long ramp

________________________________________________________

CARPARK

*no disabled*
1. upper level of top floor/middle of light blue
staircase
2. bottom of dark blue staircase/lower level of middle
floor
3. upper level of bottom floor/lower level of top floor
4. lower level of bottom floor/top of yellow
staircase
5. upper level of middle floor
6. middle of orange staircase

*1 slot disabled*
--lower level of bottom floor/lower level of top floor
--upper level of top floor/middle of orange staircase
--lower level of middle floor/middle of light blue
staircase
--top of yellow staircase/upper level of middle floor
--bottom of dark blue staircase/upper level of bottom
floor

*2 slots disabled*
--middle of orange staircase/top of yellow staircase/
lower level of middle floor
--lower level of bottom floor/bottom of dark blue
staircase
--lower level of top floor/upper level of top floor/
upper level of middle floor
--upper level of bottom floor/middle of light blue
staircase

*3 slots disabled*
--lower level of top floor/middle of orange staircase/
upper level of bottom floor
--bottom of dark blue staircase/lower level of middle
floor/upper level of middle floor
--top of yellow staircase/upper level of top floor/
middle of light blue staircase/lower level of bottom
floor

*4 slots disabled*
--upper level of top floor/lower level of top floor/
middle of light blue staircase/upper level of middle
floor/upper level of bottom floor
--lower level of bottom floor/bottom of dark blue
staircase/lower level of middle floor/middle of orange
staircase/top of yellow staircase

________________________________________________________

RAVINE

*no disabled*
1. long orange hallway at bottom/next to gold climb pipe
2. indoor yellow ramp/top of indoor yellow ramp
3. by the highest rail/room at top of long orange
hallway
4. hallway high above gold pipe/platform above long open
walkway
5. outside bottom of indoor yellow ramp
6. above top of indoor yellow ramp

*1 slot disabled*
--long orange hallway at bottom/above top of indoor
yellow ramp
--indoor yellow ramp/next to gold climb pipe
--top on indoor yellow ramp/by the highest rail
--hall high above gold pipe/room at top of long orange
hallway
--platform above long open walkway/outside bottom of
indoor yellow ramp

*2 slots disabled*
--long orange hallway at bottom/room at top of long
orange hallway/outside bottom of indoor yellow ramp
--above top of indoor yellow ramp/platform above long
open walkway/indoor yellow ramp
--next to gold climb pipe/by the highest rail
--hall high above gold pipe/top of indoor yellow ramp

*3 slots disabled*
--by the highest rail/above top of indoor yellow ramp/
room at top of long orange hallway
--long orange hallway at bottom/next to gold climb pipe/
platform above long open walkway/hall high above gold
pipe
--top of indoor yellow ramp/indoor yellow ramp/outside
bottom of indoor yellow ramp

*4 slots disabled*
--long orange hallway at bottom/room at top of long
orange hallway/next to gold climb pipe/outside bottom
of indoor yellow ramp/by the highest rail
--hall high above gold pipe/above top of indoor yellow
ramp/top of indoor yellow ramp/indoor yellow ramp/
platform above long open walkway

________________________________________________________

G5 BUILDING

*no disabled*
1. under walkway before blue deadend/next to trap door
2. blue deadend/under trap door
3. bridge outside blue deadend/room near bottom of long
upramp
4. highest bridge next to wall/balcony near highest
bridge
5. top of long upramp
6. walkway before blue deadend

*1 slot disabled*
--under walkway before blue deadend/under the trap door
--next to trap door/walkway before blue deadend
--bridge outside blue deadend/highest bridge next to
wall
--balcony near highest bridge/top of long upramp
--room near bottom of long upramp/blue deadend

*2 slots disabled*
--walkway before blue deadend/under the trap door/
balcony by highest bridge
--highest bridge next to wall/blue deadend
--room by bottom of long upramp/under walkway before
blue deadend
--bridge outside blue deadend/top of long upramp/next to
trap door

*3 slots disabled*
--balcony near highest bridge/highest bridge next to
wall/next to trap door/under walkway before blue deadend
--room by bottom of long upramp/walkway before blue
deadend/bridge outside blue deadend
--top of long upramp/blue deadend/under trap door

*4 slots disabled*
--under walkway before blue deadend/next to trap door/
bridge outside blue deadend/top of long upramp/room near
bottom of long upramp
--walkway before blue deadend/blue deadend/balcony by
highest bridge/highest bridge next to wall/under trap
door

________________________________________________________

SKEDAR

*no disabled*
1. floor between 2 balconies/divider room by glass
floor(1)/divider room by glass floor(2)
2. dead end balcony/glass floor room/ramps room near
divider
3. ramps room near trap door room/floor of giant hole
room/behind pillar down from glass floor room
4. room with trap door/dead end of snow tunnel
5. dead end down from glass floor room/elbow hallway by
ramps room
6. divider room by balconies/start of the tunnel

*1 slot disabled*
--glass floor room/divider room by glass floor(1)/ramps
room near trap door room
--floor between 2 balconies/start of the tunnel/elbow
hallway near ramps room
--divider room by balconies/divider room by glass
floor(2)/ramps room near divider
--deadend balcony/room with trap door/floor of giant
hole room
--deadend of snow tunnel/behind pillar down from glass
floor room/dead end down from glass floor room

*2 slots disabled*
--divider room by glass floor(1)/deadend down from glass
floor room/floor of giant hole room/floor between 2
balconies
--ramps room by divider/start of the tunnel/dead end of
snow tunnel/deadend balcony
--elbow hallway near ramps room/ramps room by trap door
room/divider room by glass floor(2)/behind pillar down
from glass floor room
--glass floor room/divider room by balconies/room with
trap door

*3 slots disabled*
--divider room by glass floor(1)/divider room by glass
floor(2)/room with trap door/floor between 2 balconies/
deadend of snow tunnel
--ramps room by divider/glass floor room/dead end down
from glass floor room/elbow hallway by ramps room/dead
end balcony
--ramps room by trap door room/start of the tunnel/
divider room by balconies/behind pillar down from glass
floor room/floor of giant hole room

*4 slots disabled*
--start of the tunnel/deadend of snow tunnel/glass floor
room/room with trap door/ramps room by divider/deadend
balcony/divider room by balconies
--behind pillar down from glass floor room/divider room
by glass floor(1)/divider room by glass floor(2)/dead
end down from glass floor/ramps room by trap door room/
elbow hallway by ramps room/floor between 2 balconies/
floor of giant hole room

________________________________________________________

RUINS

*no disabled*
1. snowy room with pillars/small pointed pillars room by
sandpaths
2. next to square hole in floor/middle of sandpath
3. top of the sandpaths/the big room
4. next to round hole in floor/shelf inside wall
5. floor of hallway with notches in ceiling
6. bottom of ramp near holes in floor

*1 slot disabled*
--small pointed pillars room by sandpaths/bottom of ramp
near holes in floor
--next to round hole in floor/top of the sandpaths
--floor of hallway with notches in ceiling/shelf inside
wall
--snowy room with pillars/middle of sandpath
--the big room/next to square hole in floor

*2 slots disabled*
--top of the sandpaths/small pointed pillars room by
sandpaths/floor of hallway with notches in ceiling
--middle of sandpath/shelf inside wall/bottom of ramp
near holes in floor/next to round hole in floor
--next to square hole in floor/next to round hole in
floor
--the big room/snowy room with pillars

*3 slots disabled*
--floor of hallway with notches in ceiling/middle of
sandpath/next to square hole in floor
--snowy room with pillars/shelf inside wall/small
pointed pillars room by sandpaths/next to round hole in
floor
--bottom of ramp near holes in floor/top of sandpaths/
the big room

*4 slots disabled*
--small pointed pillars room by sandpaths/snowy room
with pillars/top of sandpaths/the big room/floor of
hallway with notches in ceiling
--bottom of ramp near holes in floor/next to square hole
in floor/next to round hole in floor/shelf inside wall/
middle of sandpath

________________________________________________________

BASE

*no disabled*
1. top of spiral ramp/bottom of spiral ramp
2. floor of center room/floor under #6
3. hallway near tiny elevator room/walkway in center
room
4. floor of shelf room/spiral ramp
5. on wall shelf
6. walkover bridge connecting 2 big rooms

*1 slot disabled*
--top of spiral ramp/walkover bridge connecting 2 big
rooms
--floor under #6/bottom of spiral ramp
--floor of center room/hallway near tiny elevator room
--floor of shelf room/walkway in center room
--on wall shelf/spiral ramp

*2 slots disabled*
--floor under #6/spiral ramp/walkover bridge
connecting 2 big rooms
--top of spiral ramp/walkway in center room/on wall
shelf
--floor of shelf room/floor of center room
--bottom of spiral ramp/hall by tiny elevator room

*3 slots disabled*
--floor under #6/floor of center room/on wall shelf
--top of spiral ramp/spiral ramp/bottom of spiral
ramp/floor of shelf room
--walkover bridge connecting 2 big rooms/walkway in
center room/hall near tiny elevator room

*4 slots disabled*
--bottom of spiral ramp/top of spiral ramp/walkway
in center room/on wall shelf/hall near tiny elevator
--floor of center room/spiral ramp/floor under #6/
floor of shelf room/walkover bridge connecting 2 big
rooms

________________________________________________________


PIPES

*no disabled*
1. top of ladder from bottom floor(1)/edge of middle
floor above pipes
2. top of ladder from bottom floor(2)/double hallway on
top floor
3. middle of the pipes/near top of spiral ramp
4. top of elevator/bottom floor corner
5. hole in middle floor above pipes
6. top of hallway to top floor

*1 slot disabled*
--top of ladder from bottom floor(2)/edge of middle
floor above pipes
--top of ladder from bottom floor(1)/top of hallway to
top floor
--double hallway on top floor/near top of spiral ramp
--hole in middle floor above pipes/bottom floor corner
--middle of pipes/top of elevator

*2 slots disabled*
--middle of the pipes/top of ladder from floor(1)/hole
in middle floor above pipes
--edge of middle floor above pipes/near top of spiral
ramp
--bottom floor corner/top of ladder from bottom
floor(2)/top of hallway to top floor
--top of elevator/double hallway on top floor

*3 slots disabled*
--top of hallway to top floor/near top of spiral ramp/
middle of the pipes
--bottom floor corner/top of ladder from bottom
floor(1)/top of elevator/edge of middle floor above
pipes
--hole in middle floor above pipes/top of ladder from
bottom floor(2)/double hallway on top floor

*4 slots disabled*
--top of ladder from bottom floor(1)/hole in middle
floor above pipes/edge of middle floor above pipes/near
top of spiral ramp/middle of the pipes
--bottom floor corner/top of ladder from bottom
floor(2)/top of hallway to top floor/double hallway on
top floor/top of elevator[/url]
 
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Wreck
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 14 Dec 2005
Posts: 7197
Location: Ontario, Canada

 PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Certainly interesting. In Lo-Res mode, I believe only five slots are available. I think Rare limited certain things a bit, to decrease the number of characters (especially unique, as all humans are Jo Combat and all Simulants dD Shocktrooper) and weapon models. So not sure how that impacts that, though I doubt many people would be playing in Lo-Res anymore. You can buy third party Expansion Paks nowadays.

Even with this useful info, I don't think certain combinations are perfectly recreatable (like Pistols or Golden Gun) without breaking something else. But if someone can prove me wrong, please do. Temple from PD is a nice place to test. Remember, you'd need to have at least Automatics (standard layout style), Pistols and Golden Gun all in their correct GE positions. If even one of them is wrong, than it's really no better than the current design.
 
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Thundera8589
Secret Agent
Secret Agent


Joined: 12 Aug 2015
Posts: 351

 PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Something just came to me. Wreck you have said in the past relating to the body armor on the weapon sets. You said that in GE the body armor was apart of the map setup in multi and in GE-X it's not. However, you did mention that you can set the body armor up like in GE as part of the map setup but choose not to due to the body armor being apart of the weapon sets.

Now, lets say if you setup the body armor on the map setup in GE-X as in GE do you get to choose the number of body armor's are on a map? If my theory is correct, why not setup a map like say Temple with one golden gun in one location and one pp7 silenced in another and then work up the setup on their respective weapon sets? or will that mean those weapons would appear on every scenario possible no matter what weapon set is used?
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Wreck
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 14 Dec 2005
Posts: 7197
Location: Ontario, Canada

 PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2016 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Whatever is included in the level setup file will be loaded every time. Right now, it can't distinguish which weapon set is in use during gameplay (we'd need a custom action block for that, if even possible). There are some flags you can set so it only loads with X amount of players, but that's only useful in certain circumstances.

I decided to do what Rareware did, which was make the armour as part of the weapon set, instead of something that is forced on the players. There are many people who think the armour is cheap, and gives an unfair advantage to whomever has it. I recall playing with a friend years back, and we basically just ran for armour constantly to keep ourselves alive for a bit longer. Anyway, I preferred what Rare did in PD, letting us get rid of armour, or replace with more weapons.

If there is a chance that a custom action could be made that reads which weapon set is being used, I already have ideas on how to handle both Pistols and Golden Gun. Outside of that, I can't see all three weapon set styles* being able to work under normal circumstances. And even still, the moment you try to customize the set (like loading Golden Gun, then choose custom, and switch Armour to Hand Grenade) it will break it, since custom uses a different ID. It's so much effort and fuss over such small details, that it could be argued if it's worth it all.

*weapon set styles (based on standard 10 total = 8 weapons, 2 armour)
2, 2, 2, 2, 2
3, 3, 2, 2
2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2
 
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Thundera8589
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 PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

That custom action block hack might be the only way for it to properly work for Pistols and Golden Gun weapon sets. I have no problem if they break if something on the custom set is changed. That seems likely to happen, I would expect that if it breaks either of them. However, I don't think it would break anything by changing the body armour. Changing the Golden Gun slot would definitely break the custom action setup 100%. Since that will be where the action block would be taking to use.

For the Pistols I would imagine in it's current weapon setup

1: DD44 Dostovei
2: PP7 (Silenced)* 1 Dostovei and 1 PP7 (Silenced)
3: PP7 (Silenced)
4: Cougar Magnum
5: Body Armor
6: Disabled

*This slot would be most likely customized to use a DD44 Dostovei in one spot location.

That would customize it to use the extra DD44 Dostovei which would mean 3 Dostovei, 3 PP7 Silenced, and 2 Cougar Magnum. The Golden Gun weapon set would be using the same method...

1: DD44 Dostovei
2: Klobb
3: KF7 Soviet
4: Golden Gun * 1 PP7 (Silenced) and 1 Golden Gun
5: Body Armor
6: Disabled

In case there is a chance for this action block I would not mind if they were the only 2 hacked weapon sets in the mod. Then if anyone wants to recreate the way their respective weapon sets are. Players can manually do so by customizing it the way they are in their current builds. Hell if anything on the patch detail read me files you can put down both weapon sets information so players if they want could use them how they were/currently are. Their weapon slot numbers may be changed around if these customized action block changes things but you can put the necessary info for them to be customized to how they are currently in a readme text file. That is of course if this custom action block hack thing can work somehow. If it breaks if something gets changed in either weapon set it's no biggy (as long as it doesn't crash the mod) as all you would have to do is exit the weapon set menu and then go back and it would go back to the default customized action block that was created for them.
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Wreck
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 PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah, changing the set to Custom (to swap any one item with something else) would spoil the action block check, since it would check for the selected set ID, and custom would be different from Pistols and Golden Gun. It wouldn't break the game, thankfully, but the effects of the action blocks would not take place.

My concept is to store a Silenced PP7 and two ammo crates with normal pistol ammunition inside the setup file at pad FFFF. That way, they won't load into the level. You create an action block to check if playing with Pistols set. If so, you move one of the four DD44's to pad FFFF, and move the extra Silenced PP7 into its place. (that means altering the base Pistols set to DD44, DD44, Silenced PP7, Magnum, Armour, Disabled). For Golden Gun, you move out the "inferior" Golden Gun and its ammo crates, and swap in the extra Silenced PP7 and the pistol ammo crates. That should update those two specific sets to match their numeric ordering in the original game. Stack and/or Library may need an additional Silenced PP7, since they have more weapons total.

This is all theory, as the action block doesn't currently exist and would need to be hacked in to replace something less useful.
 
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 PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Ah I see. So this would mean for both weapon sets it would be a PP7 Silenced be worked with the action block. I was thinking the pistols weapon set would need an extra DD44 Dostovei to replace a pp7 silenced in the action block and a pp7 silenced in the action block for the golden gun. However, your theory makes the hack more simpler by both weapon sets using a pp7 silenced in the action block instead.

Maybe this hack could be tested on the current PD patch you're working on? or perhaps on GE-X since not much is being done for it at the moment.
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 PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

If this custom action block hack comes to light some day and works out as you mentioned. I say when it comes to Citadel's setup for the use of the Golden Gun weapon set. Put the "inferior" Golden Gun (PP7 silenced in it's place) in the location where that big open area with the body armor on the platform is with the two pillars and mantle underneath it where the "inferior" Golden Gun was and replace that with the PP7 silenced. Since it would be too easy for sims to get the Golden Gun and Body Armor all the time since they are in close proximity to each other. Not to mention that location in the map is a spawn point where anyone can quickly grab the Golden Gun there with ease. Rather, the true Golden Gun location in Citadel will be where that high climbing platform is. You start collecting the Golden Bullets until you reach the top to get the Golden Gun.
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 PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I also first thought about hiding an extra DD44 for Pistols, but when I realized each special set included the Silenced PP7, it made more sense to just share that between them. I think only Library would probably require an additional one, as it incorporates more weapons in the map. The rest should all use eight weapons and two armours as standard.

I haven't thought about the bonus levels, but that is a good decision on Citadel. I'd have to ask SubDrag if this is even possible, as it's outside my realm of knowledge. I was hoping he could repurpose an action block that we won't need for GE-X, and use that as an "If Weapon Set ID Equals, Go to Return Value" action. I can easily handle the setups after that. But again, I have no clue how diificult this may be, if possible.
 
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 PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

It wouldn't hurt to ask SubDrag as this would be really neat to look into before releasing the WIP patch. If this delays the release until christmas I can wait a few more weeks for this hack to be put in place and possibly hopefully function. It would be great to have both those two weapon sets accurate to the original once again and ready for the next release.
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 PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Another thing to note about this custom action block is the fix for the Pistols weapon set should be a lot easier especially since the ammunition for the DD44 Dostvei and PP7 Silenced are the same. They both share the same ammo. So ammo crates are unnecessary to deal with for Pistols.

Another thing to note also and I don't want to mix it up with your theory Wreck, is how does flag token work for "Living Daylights"? I can imagine it's called up some how on an action block. The flag token only spawns in one area where a weapon is located but no longer spawns there. It can temporarily replace an ammo crate. Then it is just passed around like hot potato. In GE007, The Man with The Golden Gun scenario IIRC the Golden Gun is located where it normally is in a map when you choose the Golden Gun Weapon set but the difference is it's also passed around like hot potato. Meaning the weapon no longer spawns in it's location but it's ammo boxes are still in it's original spot.

Wreck, How do you think this ties up with your theory for the Pistols and Golden Gun weapon set? And do you believe there is some sort of connection here that can lead the GE-X Team to the way where they can discover a way to get both unique weapon sets to be hacked and restore them to how they were laid out in the original GE game?
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 PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

You bring up an interesting concern. I am not completely sure exactly how the spawned in special scenario items (Flag Tag Token, GoldenEye Key, Mainframe Terminal) are handled. Now, I think these items are randomly assigned to a valid pad position at the start of a level. Should it select a pad currently being used by another pickup (weapon or armour), than that pickup is temporarily replaced. Once the special item is procured, the pickup that belongs in that position will spawn back in. If this is the case, than we should be safe, as we aren't moving a pad around for the gun or ammo crate, but the pickup itself. The special item should find its way to a valid pad inside the level. I base my thoughts on when I once tested making the G5 Building mission version into a Combat Simulator level, and the Hacker Central computer loaded in the outside fire escape area, on a pad you could not reach. But your concerns are something to consider when testing, should this all become a reality.

As for GoldenEye, they set the Flag Tag Token in the setup file as a pickup, which always spawns at the same exact pad every time. Perfect Dark takes the special pickups from either the 39850 file, or from ASM, and loads them in only when the corresponding game scenario is chosen.
 
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 PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Maybe this stuff can be looked at for another release. It would be cool if another scenario can be created using the Living Daylights scenario but replacing the flag with the Golden Gun. It would probably need to use one of the available weapon slots for it to have it's own ammo crates and for the Golden Gun to load up. Then it wouldn't become a pickup once it's been picked up by a player/sim. Of course, this is completely getting out of the original topic which was about recreating the original Pistols and Golden Gun sets for GE-X. Can this stuff even possibly be looked into?
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 PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I don't know about a The Man With The Golden Gun scenario, but... I did receive an encouraging message from SubDrag about a custom action. So we may see soon just what we can do to update the Pistols and Golden Gun sets. Stay tuned!
 
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 PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wow awesome!
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