GoldenEye 007 Nintendo 64 Community, GoldenEye X, Nintendo 64 Games Discussion

[bmw]

Growing up, I owned a Sega Genesis and a Sega CD but sold them on ebay long ago. Recently, I decided to buy them again as I recently discovered that the library of games for both the Genesis and Sega CD is actually pretty good.

But being picky about picture quality, I wanted something better than the composite output. The Sega Genesis natively outputs RGB and with the proper equipment, it looks phenomenal.

After doing much research, I settled on a Micomsoft XRGB-3 upscaler. Micomsoft's XRGB units are considered the best out there for upscaling 240p content. So with the proper cable (no modding required), I have my hardware connected as follows:

Sega CD/Sega Genesis ----> Sega RGB to JP21 cable ----> JP21 input on XRGB-3 ----> VGA output to my VGA CRT monitor

The XRGB-3 has a line-doubler mode which upconverts the 240p 15khz signal to 640x480 30khz for a standard VGA monitor and does so with virtually no time delay (I think its around 3ms, or 1/5 of an NTSC frame). With the proper settings on the device, the picture quality on my CRT monitor is absolutely amazing.

Here is a video I was able to take. Be sure to watch it in 720p mode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3amoc2Fh1-M

Unfortunately, My N64 over S-video doesn't look that great on this device. I can't help but wonder what an RGB modded N64 would look like on it.

Last edited by bmw on Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:24 am; edited 1 time in total

[MRKane]

Gee that looks nice! This forum needs a "like" button

From the information I've read a RGB mod is best done on a NTSC platform so I've not investigated it myself (being PAL) but in general it looks really really nice if you can manage it!

What was the issue with the sVideo upscaling? scan line issues, colour problems, or was a moire pattern present?
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No Mr. Bond, I expect you to be re-coded!

[bmw]

The s-video from the N64 was just not a sharp picture at all. In fact, the s-video through my much cheaper S-video to VGA adapter looked better.

The XRGB-3 had 2 different display modes - B0 and B1. B0 mode includes the internal filtering done to the picture and B1 is nothing more than line-doubling with no extra processing done to the signal. In B0 mode, the picture is ugly and in B1, the picture is sharper but I ran into strange dot clock issues. I'll have to post some screenshots.

Anyways, here is a comparison on the Sega of S-video vs. RGB from my device so you can see that going from S-video to RGB is as much of an improvement as going from composite to s-video.

[MRKane]

It's easy to see what you mean there! Even just the colour from RGB! You don't get any overheat issues?
_________________
No Mr. Bond, I expect you to be re-coded!

[bmw]

Overheating? Nothing is actually modified, it is a special Sega Genesis Model 1 to JP-21 cable which connects directly to the original Genesis port with no internal modifications to the Genesis itself.

I'm now very tempted to buy an RGB-modded N64. Apparently the earlier serial number versions of the system could be easily modified to add RGB to the original output, so all I would need then is a special N64 to JP-21 cable which I can get for about $15.

[MRKane]

I'd be dead keen to hear how it goes! I was looking at mine and wondering if it was worth going to the effort. Now you know those computer connections that most TVs now support? I've a feeling one of those might be suitable for modification into a RGB input but I've never really looked into it myself.

By "overheating" what I meant was a colour overheat on the NTSC (or hybrid) televisions, which is usually a result of the red channel coming in too strong causing the signal to get a bit muddled and there's a bit of bleeding that goes around the edges of the red. PAL doesn't have this issue - in saying that PAL has a lower framerate
_________________
No Mr. Bond, I expect you to be re-coded!

[bmw]

There are 2 issues with converting RGB to a VGA-type port. First, your tv must support the 15khz horizontal scan rate output by older 240p consoles such as the N64 (which, I believe most newer tv's actually can do this).

Secondly, your tv must be able to use the signal without a horizontal sync signal as VGA is actually RGBHV (red, green, blue, horizontal sync, vertical sync). The RGB output of older consoles includes a vertical sync signal but no horizontal sync (its output is RGBC, aka RGBV). My XRGB-3 converter has a 15-pin VGA input and in the menu options I can change the input type from YUV to RGBHV to RGBC so any of those types of signals work. I'm not sure what options tvs have for the 3 types of signal inputs.

Now, SNES/N64 to SCART cables are fairly easy to find online. The issue is then converting the SCART to a 15-pin VGA output. You would need to either look up some pinout diagrams and modify the cable yourself, cutting off the SCART port and replacing it with a VGA port, or if you don't want to modify anything, you would need 2 adapters - an SCART gender changer and then an SCART to VGA cable (and even then, that only works assuming that the pinouts match,).

As to my setup, I have no color bleed issues. Even if I did, my XRGB-3 has quite a few image options, such as I can separately modify my red, green, and blue output and gamma levels. This XRGB-3 box is REALLY nice. They're a bit on the expensive side (I got mine imported from Japan for $240 ), but they really do work great for many older consoles.

Here are the front and back panels of my converter:



It has 2 S-video inputs, 2 composite inputs, a 15-pin VGA/RGB/YUY input, and a 21-pin JP21 (Japanese version of SCART - SCART cables will FRY your board if you use them on this device, you have to make sure its a JP21 connector)

[mistamontiel]

'Gender' can be changed 0.o

Fantastic type-up homey , cheers
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[bmw]

I finally went ahead and purchased an RGB-modded N64.

Now I just have to wait for my N64 to RGB-SCART cable to arrive from the UK. Could be several weeks.

I'll post some screenshots when I have my new hardware.

[bmw]

Here are some screenshots of my N64 over RGB to my XRGB-3. The signal is fed to a VGA capture device where some quality is lost, but these are pretty close to how it looks when directly fed to my monitor.

[Dylan]

I'm curious as to how an unmodified genesis outputs an s-video signal. I believe the video encoder chip has chroma and luma on it but it ultimately went unused.

Speaking of n64 rgb mods, I own an RGB modded system and I must say, I wasn't impressed by it. The upgrade from s-video (using the purple ones from Monster) wasn't too spectacular or mind blowing. Sure, there's a quality increase but it really isn't much And to be honest I had to compare them both right after each other to notice any minor differences.

So, you do get a quality boost with RGB but it isn't going to be as if you took a snes from s video and used rgb. If I could describe it, tthe snes, genesis, and modded nes systems output near emulator like quality with rgb while the n64 does not.