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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:51 am    Post subject: Starting simple Reply with quote Back to top

I am going to a crack at this soon, and I am going to start really simple. Just a single cube room with 2 textures. 1 for the walls and 1 for the floor/ceiling.

I also plan to document everything to help other noobs with the essential baby steps. This honestly looks really complicated and I am completely impressed at what has been accomplished but at the same time feel overwhelmed.

There is so much to read and the tutorial looks like Greek to me, I guess it will fall in place when I start.

But first question time:

1) Can I get by with just Blender and GE Setup Editor for now?

2) The 4 part video was released ages ago, so has the processed changed much since then, that is the software required now and the one he uses been stream lined any?

I was thinking if I document everything and include the models I make and such (much like a book) along with the patches that it could really help people who may really want to jump in but are even more intimidated than myself.

So the "projects” could all be building blocks.

Project 1:

A) Build a single cube room with ground and ceiling one texture,and walls another texture.


The purpose of the intial project is not to overwhelm the person starting out.
Also it is to teach them (me, lol) how to apply textures, and do clipping on a primitive.
Blender starts with a cube. We just want them to create a model, apply textures, import it, clip it, make the texture file in notepad... All that stuff that I myself have yet to do in practice.

B) Make the patch and apply it. Check it out on the emulator.

Project 2:

A) with the model from Project 1 add a second room next to this one. And remove the wall joining them.

The purpose of this project is to teach about portals. If the first project didn't cause them to rage flip there computer desk and run out into the street then we can move forward. These are all baby steps. So I purposely want to keep it as simple as possible from project to project.

Project 3:

Not sure what this should be entirely. Possible ideas for the next baby step
Removing the ceiling from project 2 and adding a skymap, making a window (that isn't destructible) to teach about transparency, or creating one if the door types. Whichever is the easiest most logical thing to learn next.

And so it goes on and on.

The final thing that would be nice,if this is possible, is that each project from start to finish could be put in it's own multiplayer slot. So they would eventually have the all the slots filled where the can visit there progress/evolution.

What are your thoughts? This is all easy for me to speculate so I may just be having wishful thinking, but in theory it sounds good.

Some information about me, I started with a TI 99 4/a (learned basic like everyone did in the 70's & 80's), then a C128 messed around learning ML to try and mimic the Crack Screen demoes on the C64. Raster Interrupts, Raster Bar Effects, Scrollers, Custom character graphics, ripped a few tunes...,. Next a got an Amiga 500, messed with AMOS basic a bunch and Mod music, then finally in 1997 I got my first PC. Tried off and on to learn C, Java but with kids, work, life I never had the time. I was using blitz basic, blitz 3D and Monkey enough in my spare time to keep me interested. At least with blitz 3d I learned a few things about 3d, models and textures. Now I work in a lab and have a 40 hour work week with weekends off. It feels like retirement after doing 12 hour shifts and working nights/split shifts etc.. plus the kids have all grown up.

So I have some time to learn some stuff and I hope to be able to help others as I learn. I also thought "why not document it and post it here? Surely it can help others get started who may at the moment be too afraid to ask or feel intimidated". I know I do.

I typed this up on my phone. Please excuse typos and mangled grammar as well as my naiveté.
 
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pavarini
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
1) Can I get by with just Blender and GE Setup Editor for now?
Yes, there is even a plugin by E-S that will aid with the export process on the vault. Check that you have the latest editor build (using the beta updater) and OBJ2AN8.
Quote:
2) The 4 part video was released ages ago, so has the processed changed much since then, that is the software required now and the one he uses been stream lined any?
The videos are very old, the workflow is different compared to the latest editor builds. You do not need to use a hex editor to set up decals. There are a couple of posts you can follow on the forum, like this one.
 
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MRKane
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I actually prefer to use the FBX export for importing maps into the GEeditor from Blender. I've been making a few at the moment, and it's finicky but is a reliable process once you've got that process down and refined and don't deviate from it.

The tutorials are a good place to begin (especially the "new levels" one), and aren't too out of date. I'd also strongly recommend not hesitating to ask questions when you get stuck! Smile
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks for links and support. I had responded earlier but somehow it seems I deleted it. I am still all ears, feel free to chime in.

I will try and find the time to create a simple model and follow the tutorials. Please keep an eye out for me as I am sure I will stuck, but this should prove rewarding.

I have a few multiplayer maps I would like to create. I mean, can you really have too many? Well, maybe so but having more options is always nice.
 
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

MRKane wrote:

The tutorials are a good place to begin especially the "new levels" one), and aren't too out of date. I'd also strongly recommend not hesitating to ask questions when you get stuck! Smile


Are you referring to: http://www.goldeneyevault.com/viewfile.php?id=217 ?
 
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MRKane
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yes that was the one I was referring to Smile

As a quick side-note: GE is substantially more forgiving than PD when it comes to creating new levels. I've been trying to make PD levels for a few months now and aren't at the point where I could write a "complete and foolproof" tutorial simply because it has less tolerance. In short: Start with Goldeneye Wink
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yes, I will stick with GoldenEye. I am looking forward to my first custom myiplayer, no matter how simple it looks.

Eventually in the distant future I want to import BanjoTooie's version of The Stack into GoldenEye, and after that the Complex, and Basement models that Rare also remodeled and retextured for Banjo-Tooie.

The carnival level looks to be a good layout for multiplayer. But it may have too many tri's. I really don't know.

I am inspired by the Mario 007 level imports. The areas are massive, which is cool. Just not really great for multiplayer but we play them anyway, with snipers, rockets, grenades... Anything that can help bridge the distance.

As I get further into this I will learn what is possible.

The Zelda village model looks complex and do again I think some of the stuff I want to create or import should work if I do it right and make some modifications.

I also understand none of this happens overnight. Lots of pain, sweat and tears. 😜
 
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pavarini
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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

While this isn't related to map importing, this does explain the workflow for importing models and can be used for maps if you follow sogun's tutorial.
 
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Wonderful. I will check it out shortly.
 
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Good news.. I finally imported a custom model into GoldenEye Setup Editor (GSE). No achievement happens without issues. One if the things that made the process a little taxing was the menu items within GSE didn't quite matchup with the tutorial. Maybe it was because version 2 of GSE was used when the tutorial was written? I will post here the differences.

I assume most people figure it out but still others may give up out of frustration.

I can also say upon repeated readings and then applying the steps, the tutorial becomes much clearer to me. It is written fairly well once you understand the flow. So kudos to the writer.
 
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

This is the second part to my message.

I end up using SketchUp to do my level or more accurately my room. I use the scale of feet and inches with in SketchUp I was hoping but with that scale I could at least build something that would look right and would be easy for me to add doors and stuff.

But apparently either the room itself is too small or the model is too small and I will have to resize it in SketchUp and import it again. The reason why I say it's too small is in the editor when I move around the model the camera moves way too fast.
GoldenEye single room https://imgur.com/a/FcQs61B

Also I had a heck of a time trying to figure out how to name groups in SketchUp. Components is more straightforward.

One last question:
Does anyone use the free version that you install on your PC and not the free browser version? Currently I can Import and Export obj files but was wondering if that goes away after a specified time.

Anyways I feel like I accomplished something even though I'm not ready to patch it yet it still feels good to get this far. I am sure many of you have felt the same way in the past.
 
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Lazlo52
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

loofadawg wrote:
But apparently either the room itself is too small or the model is too small and I will have to resize it in SketchUp and import it again. The reason why I say it's too small is in the editor when I move around the model the camera moves way too fast.

I don't know anything about this particular process, but...is it because the level you're on has a small scale? A number of GE levels have small scale. You can change it while opening a setup file or in the 21990 game configuration.

Oh, and congrats on your progress!
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MRKane
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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

As Lazlo52 said: The scales in Goldeneye vary with the different levels. In Perfect Dark, however, there's a set scale.

Now talking about real world scales...I've always modelled by pulling out an obj of a map that I might be replacing, and trying to scale my rooms according to the scale demonstrated in that obj (which is a good way to get your feet). The other trap here is that "real world things" don't necessarily look "real world" inside the game when you come to look at them, so don't be discouraged if things look wonky when you first try them out as it could be "perspective warping" from the game engine Smile
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loofadawg
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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Once again, thanks guys.

Onto something different...

Man I was getting frustrated with the clipping tutorial because I just wasn't making any sense to me I mean part of it was but part of it didn't but then I search the forums and found where Shogun was explaining the clipping and how the clipping tutorial wasn't quite correct and now I feel whole lot better I still don't quite understand it yet because I haven't finished reading what Shogun had said but I'm confident it all fall together now.

mainly the tutorial saying clockwise when the other says counterclockwise and everything I see in the clipping in the editor is always counterclockwise. That's the part that got me. I get bogged down in the details and if I don't understand something along the way it will trip me up. Sometimes I can move forward in the hopes it will make sense but if I get to another bit which I don't understand I find myself hoplessly stuck going back and forth, then searching for answers... Hours pass and I am ready to throw my hands up. Lol.

If I can grasp this, anyone can. And if I can grasp it, I think a supplementary tutorial maybe in Powerpoint is in order. I think I can put it together where other people won't get stuck not saying we're going to replace the ones already here but a different viewpoint and explanation might be what it takes to get more people who are interested to jump on board.

I think I can put a free mini ones together in my spare time. Besides, it will help me in the process so it isn't really a selfless act. 😁
 
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SubDrag
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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

That probably is out of date. Anyways, you just make a perfect triangle mesh. Every point has to exactly touch, there can be no overlap. It's the spots you walk or crawl or ladder. Don't worry about clockwise or counter.
 
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